Monday, May 5, 2008

The Glory of the Celestial

Jesus Christ is the only way to salvation but salvation is not the only way to everlasting life.

A Christian is born of God’s seed, is now body, soul, and spirit. A son by birth. The saints. The body of Christ. Our body, soul, and spirit will be quickened if dead or changed if alive at the rapture. Unconditional eternal life giving spirit beings to reign in the new heaven and the new Earth. Grace Age.

David is not saved yet he will have everlasting life on Earth after the resurrection. Conditional immortal body, soul and an ethereal spiritual connection. As long as they drink from the river of life proceeding out of the throne of God with the tree of life in the midst. Paradise on Earth. Rev 22:1, 2, 17. He is not ascended to heaven. Old testament believers, adopted sons, the bride of Christ, were not spirits in limbo that Christ took to heaven with him. They are dead. The Law Age.

Those who live today who do not hear enough of the word to believe but “worketh righteousness” are accepted with God (Acts 10:35) and will have everlasting life on Earth after the resurrection. Same condition as Old Testament. Not to be confused with the Gathering Together or rapture of those born again in Christ before the great tribulation and resurrection. All the ages.

All the dead are dead until the rapture followed by the resurrection of the just and unjust. Then the second death which is final. They are neither in heaven or a burning hell or anywhere in between. They are dead except one, Jesus Christ.

This was posted in response to The Reward in Heaven on Truth or Tradition web site. As it is no longer available the following links are similar:
Working in the Future Kingdom; What will we be doing in heaven?"

"The New Body: Looking good and feeling fine."

Also: You Must Be Born Again

So what distinguishes the saved in Christ from those who are resurrected unto everlasting life? After all, God says we (in Christ) are sanctified or separated out from among all others (I Coronthians1: 2) and have a glory above all other glories. (2 Corinthians 3:8-11; 1 Corinthians 2:7) What separates us is we will have free reign IN HEAVEN as well as on Earth, as opposed to just on Earth. The verses you mention are written and confined to Israel and those who will inherit the Earth. I’m surprised at how accurately you rightly divide the administrations except for after the return.
Jesus Christ certainly rightly divided the future. When stated by the malefactor on the cross “ Lord remember me when you enter your Kingdom.” Jesus knew that the malefactor could not be with him in his Kingdom (heaven) for he was not born again of God’s spirit by seed. It was not available yet (John 3). Jesus corrected him by saying you have a future with me in Paradise (his kingdom on Earth). Paradise is not heaven. He said to the Pharisees, “where I go you cannot go.” Heaven or paradise. He told Peter and the Apostles you cannot go now but later you can. Because Pentecost and the future gathering together or rapture must take place first.
There are other obvious verses placing us with Christ in heaven. I’m not sure why you chose verses only pertaining to Israel (who are the adopted sons as opposed to sons by birth) regarding a future on Earth. That which is born of Spirit is spirit. It is also raised a spiritual body (1 Corin 15). Surely you don’t really believe spirit beings of light will be bound here on Earth? Partakers of divine nature are not flesh and bone but holy and spiritual. Your interpretation that our body will only be flesh and bone is based on one verse from the resurrected Christ and is a giant leap of assumption. By leap I mean for example when you quote from "The Reward In Heaven" you use 1 Peter 1:4 (reserved in heaven) and Colossians 1: 5 (stored up for you in heaven) and say “Jesus was talking to Jews who knew that they would inherit the Earth” when it was not Jesus but actually Peter and Paul who knew they were talking to those separated into the kingdom of his dear son and the elect who are set apart by way of the spirit. (Col 1;13; 1 Peter 1:2). To lump those verses with the gospels is is not rightly dividing the word as I see it. You use the same technique when claiming that Jesus was flesh and bone only when in truth you said that, not Jesus (Luke 24:39). He said as I have, not I am. Also, he was not yet ascended into his glorious new body. (He was glorified after the ascension John 7:39). Your definition of a spiritual body is that of your own . Because of your interpretation of this verse, the whole premise of this teaching is flawed and not convincing. The article a indicates a spirit, (when used in King James never refers to a Godly spirit) thus being translated ghost or spirit being or a spirit to be afraid of is accurately translated. It’s clear from the context of verse 37 that Jesus was responding according to what they were terrified of and what they supposed they saw when he said ..." for a spirit."

As for Jesus visit with Nicodemus, the book of John is all about Jesus telling of things to come that were not in scripture or clearly understood in the Old Testament. It is also a book about seed and the new birth and being Sons of God by birth, not adoption. “ But as many as received him, to them he gave power to become the Sons of God who were begotten of God, not by flesh and blood of man.” This sets the tone. “Of his fullness have we all received.” Past tense. The Kingdom of God is what he foretold. It came on the Day of Pentecost. We are never told to look for the coming of the Kingdom of God after Pentecost. This notion and teaching that Jesus didn’t know anything pertaining to the mystery is old school from a confined theory in a box. You have to tippy toe around too many verses to still believe that. Eph 3:5 “ …as it (the mystery) is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets.” Jesus was a “prophet” (the prophet according to Jn 7:40) “Now” has been privately interpreted as a window opened only to Paul at that time. Jesus foretold of being born of the spirit,. Jn 3. He reproved Nicodemus for not connecting the miracles he mentioned from the beginning to a man of the Pharisees and not believing in the power of God of the Old Testament as able to perform this new birth. He foretold how to enter the Kingdom of God when it became available was by being born of the spirit, Jn 3:3. He foretold to the woman at the well that in the future God seeks those to worship him in spirit and truth. Jn 4:23, 24 (speaking in tongues). He foretold of receiving the gift of holy spirit and speaking in tongues was the manifestation (in a metaphor) of having received. Jn 7:38, 39. He foretold of his ascension. John 3: 14. He foretold of salvation. Jn 3;16, 17. (saved: to be made whole; having spirit within permanently, eternally). He foretold of being baptized in the spirit. (The new birth). Acts 1:5; Matt 3: 11. He foretold of speaking in tongues. Mark 16: 17.
He foretold how to receive the holy spirit when the time came (Pentecost) by instructing the apostles to breath in when the sign appeared (cloven tongues) . Jn 20:22. He foretold of being one spiritually and glorified. Jn 17. How close to the one body is that? He told to them to go unto the uttermost parts of the world. Adding the gentiles was part of building his church and of the one body. Jesus knew a lot about the mystery. God said “he shall see his seed” at the cross. Isaiah 53: 10. He saw his seed as one glorious distinct and separate spiritual body. God revealed it to him as he proclaimed,

“ My God, my God, this was my destiny.”

Our reign is with Him who openly will share His Heavenly Kingdom reserved for us (1Peter 1:4, 5). Revealed in the last time, eternal in the heavens. That’s the more glorious truth of 2 Corinthians 3: 8, 9 and 1 Corinthians 2:7. I Corin 15 states “To every seed his own body…the glory of the celestial is one the, the glory of the earthly is another.” “Everything after it’s kind” is the Genesis of the Biblical teaching of seed.

Under your Difficult Verses section:
I Corinthians 15:50 You say that “Some people have used this verse to show that each saved person will be spirit instead of flesh and that the saved will not be on earth in the future but in heaven.” Then you say, “ Both of these ideas are erroneous.” Why? Because you say they are? Do they really say they won’t be on earth “also?” Or in addition to being in heaven? No. That’s what you say they say. Why shouldn’t a person conclude what the word says that he will become a ‘spiritual body?” Or “become a life giving spirit?” To build a whole theology around Jesus resurrected appearance stating “ can a spirit have flesh and bone” and “in his glorified body Christ had flesh and bone” is erroneous. How do you know that was his glorified body? Could he have received a glorified body after the ascension? Paul saw him as ‘One born out of due time” after his ascension and said nothing about flesh and bones, therefore I can now declare by my interpretation that he was given a glorified body after the ascension. You conclude in a private interpretation “Therefore flesh can most definitely enter the Kingdom of God.” Let’s throw out all those surrounding verses referring to our “raised a spiritual body” in keeping with our erroneous ideas. The same private interpretation can be said for your quote after 1 Corinthians 15: 51-53 stating “ The above verses say Christians will be changed but not into spirit beings”. Doesn’t say “Christians” first of all, and again no regard for the many clear verses declaring “afterward the spiritual”, or ‘bear the image of the heavenly man” Jesus Christ, calling our attention to the stark difference to Adam who was flesh and bone. If this chapter exhausts itself to distinguish and clarify the difference between spirit and flesh and our heavenly future, I’m surprised by your misinterpretation of what Jesus meant in the context with Thomas?

You state, “The purpose of this study is to show that the future home of the saved is on earth, not in heaven.” The problem is you use the majority of the versus written to the Jews, not the saved. Therefore, based on one scripture (Luke 24: 39) you ‘squeeze’ this viewpoint on all the versus pertaining to a future in heaven as being “erroneous.” Concluding that “if the disciples were not expecting Christ to go to heaven, they certainly would not have thought they were going” because of what he said in Acts 1:6. They weren’t expecting to speak in tongues either. Are we to use your same logic that we’re not really speaking in tongues? Of course they didn’t know about going to heaven. They were Jews! Not yet saved. How many other truths did they not yet know? Several! Because they didn’t know or expect doesn’t negate any of the truths revealed to them later. Including our glorious, uniquely, extremely different, eternal future with Christ in heaven. It’s inconsistent to lump versus that are obviously written to Israel, who definitely are inheriting the earth and not entering the Kingdom of God in heaven, as written to us. How can you rightly divide the administrations regarding to whom it is written properly only to provide at your liberty an exception to join us all together in the end as if there were never any difference?

Jesus was not “refuting the idea he was spirit” as you say but a spirit. We will be given a new body that is fashioned like his “spiritual“ body with or without flesh and bones to soar through the heavens as we please for our citizenship, not a temporary visa, is in heaven. Can we visit Earth? Why not? Can we eat and take hot showers? Why not? To say we are limited to being on Earth with no existence in heaven is nonsense. You just have it backwards. Our temporary visits are in Paradise, our home is in Heaven.

You even teach yourself from The Sacred Secret “ many people think that God always deals with people the same way that he will treat us, but this is not the case, God has something for us that was never done before the Church Age” and “we even ascended with him and are seated with him in heaven, which is exactly where we will be after the rapture.” “Christians will be taken up to heaven to be with Christ.” To say this is only for seven years is another leap of assumption of private interpretation.

I believe you are rightly dividing in that teaching but for some reason you decided to leave heaven for good and retire on Earth. I’ll stick with the word and have both.

Enjoy and appreciate your site and teachings immensely.

Thank you,
Michael Meyer